Patrick Alexander ([info]zpxlng) wrote,
@ 2008-03-21 02:14:00
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XKCD
Some postin' from the webcomics megathread at Something Awful...

* * *


I know better than to get involved in this sort of discussion, but whatever, I'm in the mood right now I guess.

Hentaikid:

Oh god it's like he wants to be successful. That bastard, it makes me sick.


Whatever. What is the point in being successful if it's not you who is successful; if you're not expressing yourself and doing your best to make a positive and worthwhile contribution to the culture. What is the point. Money? You can earn money any old how. When you are in a politically or -- as is the case with Munroe -- culturally influential position, you have a responsibility to improve people's lives; to add something good or interesting or thoughtful or helpful to the world.

XKCD doesn't do that. It feeds on shit, and shits that shit out again, tenfold -- out into the world, condoning, validating and encouraging even more shit.

Nobody wins here! XKCD's readers aren't challenged; their lives aren't enriched; and Munroe himself... Once, he expressed himself with XKCD. It mightn't have been brilliant, but it was at least honest and hopefully therapeutic. But now, it has fans. Fans who embrace and validate the very personality problems that Munroe might have otherwise used the comic to work through. They (and he) have made it too easy to be Randall Munroe. Now, he -- and as a consequence, his comic -- will stay the same, maybe for the rest of his life. And he's too young and stupid for that.

But fuck Munroe; I don't know the guy -- it's his comic that's the problem.

The issue with XKCD -- and all shitty webcomics -- is not whether it's a comic or not. The issue is not whether Munroe is more or less popular than other cartoonists who are more talented and have worked harder for success. The issue is that XKCD is shit. It is shit. And when I look at the culture we inhabit, one thing I can say without doubt or hesitation is that we

DON'T

NEED

MORE

SHIT.

No, I don't have to read XKCD, or Ctrl+Alt+Del, or Questionable Content. But they exist, and they retard the culture, and that affects me. So fuck them. The onus is not upon me to ignore them, the onus is upon them to fuck off and die.

Don't talk to me about success. Success is not something that makes the world worse.

* * *


PresterJohn:

A responsibility to improve people's lives? Come on, dude.

While I can agree that extremely good comics might demonstrably improve readers' lives


Perhaps I should clarify. What I mean is that good art improves people's selves, which in turn improves their lives and the lives of those they interact with -- which is ultimately all of society.

Phylodox:

Yeah, I don't think people get retarded from reading XKCD or eating at McDonald's or watching reality television.


Well they certainly don't get any fucking smarter.

And what if there were no XKCD, no McDonald's, no reality television? What if the people who create things created them intelligently and responsibly; what if the whole culture was enriching, and not just bits of it? Would that perpetuate, do you think? I like to think that it would.

I'm speaking idealistically, of course. But ideals can and should inform pragmatic decisions.



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[info]harveyjames
2008-03-20 07:55 pm UTC (link)
Man you can't stop people making crap. Someone will always find a lower common denominator to aim at. It doesn't bother us because WE CAN RAISE OUR HEADS UP HIGH, BRO

Let's concentrate on what we like, not what we don't like! Gosh!

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-21 03:56 am UTC (link)
Let's concentrate on what we like, not what we don't like! Gosh!

I actually agree with this completely. I was just a bit tipsy and annoyed last night.

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[info]coyotecoyote
2008-03-20 10:16 pm UTC (link)
The way I see it, and you may disagree, XKCD isn't taking people who would normally be reading good comics and feeding them crap. XKCD is taking people who would normally not be reading any comics at all. And once they start reading XKCD, they learn about other, better drawn webcomics and the whole community benefits.

It's hard for me personally to find fault with introducing new readers to webcomics.

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[info]coyotecoyote
2008-03-20 10:18 pm UTC (link)
--and the reason XKCD is so popular is because there are no other math nerd comics out there. When you're the only game in town, people aren't going to be very picky.

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[info]deadseraphim89
2008-03-22 02:01 pm UTC (link)
That doesn't change the fact it's not funny.

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[info]coyotecoyote
2008-03-22 03:17 pm UTC (link)
Who said it did?

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-21 04:24 am UTC (link)
And once they start reading XKCD, they learn about other, better drawn webcomics and the whole community benefits.

Maybe, maybe not. People say this sort of thing, but I'm not convinced it's true (or false, mind you).

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[info]natesoehardi
2008-03-20 10:41 pm UTC (link)
All we can do is make a product of better quality. Y'know set the standard and encourage others to raise the bar.

We can't be the culture police.

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-21 04:21 am UTC (link)
Of course; it's not anyone's place to police culture. I'm simply advocating a sense of 'cultural responsibility', for people in the creative field, or any position of influence.

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Disagreement
[info]imsoalone
2008-03-21 02:41 am UTC (link)
Jesus F-Troup!! Must you hate on everything I hold dear, Patrick?

How can you put forward that XKCD is shit? It's not just the same staid bunch of Video game/Gay Jokes. Surely the proof is in the pudding. The goal of a web comic is to be enjoyed, and heaps of people enjoy it. The best side effect of this comic is that it DOES enrich people's lives. They start thinking and learning about maths. They enjoy it on a whole new level. I've never been inspired to learn by VG Cats (although I do enjoy it).

The notion that exposing people to maths in a fun and engaging manner 'retards' the culture makes absolutely no sense.


Okay, I'm sure you're convinced by my argument now :)

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-21 04:15 am UTC (link)
XKCD's math jokes have never prompted me to think and/or learn about maths. They're written for people who are math nerds already. It certainly doesn't help that they're not funny.

But don't get me wrong -- XKCD used to be fairly enjoyable because there was some real personal expression in there. But now it's just pandering nerd shit. Math reference; high five! Hey guys I argue about Mythbusters with my geek girlfriend! Hey I think that women are special and wonderful and I truly respect them. "Oh! Oh! Me too! Hey geek girls, look at my XKCD t-shirt! It means I'm sensitive!"

He doesn't experiment anymore; it's just stick-figures being unfunny.

I mean, really and truly, it hasn't been the slightest bit funny in months.

Also, "heaps of people enjoy it"? Come on Dan, you know as well as anyone that popularity doesn't signify quality.

BUT ANYWAY. I was mostly just using XKCD as an example, to make some broadly applicable points. XKCD happened to be the topic of discussion at the time. It's a terrible comic, but there are even more terrible comics that might have made better examples, in retrospect. But it was a ranty forum post, not an essay.

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[info]hentaikid
2008-03-21 01:31 pm UTC (link)
MAN YOU ARE SO PRINCIPLED, CAN I TOUCH THE HEM OF YOUR FLOWING ROBE??

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-21 02:13 pm UTC (link)
If you sit quietly and behave yourself.

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[info]eggstorm
2008-03-21 05:21 pm UTC (link)
Look at you go! Rantin' away, Hi fives!

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-21 07:21 pm UTC (link)
Rene! What up, homegirl!

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[info]eggstorm
2008-03-23 08:29 pm UTC (link)
Hey baby! I am in London having a great time. Thinking you are absolutely adorable eating tiny bananas down there. Well done!

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[info]rocketpantsu
2008-04-03 05:59 am UTC (link)
Is that the first person to comment on your tiny banana "down there".

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[info]deadseraphim89
2008-03-22 01:53 pm UTC (link)
Someone else who hates XKCD. I thought I was alone. :o

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[info]harveyjames
2008-03-30 02:54 am UTC (link)
Tim Burton's Wikipedia article...

"Burton's ubiquitous signature style extends even to his own body. According to wife Helena Bonham Carter, he has black and white stripes tattooed along the width of his genitals. [10]"

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[info]zpxlng
2008-03-31 01:29 pm UTC (link)
You are a wonderful man, James Harvey.

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[info]harveyjames
2008-03-31 07:40 pm UTC (link)
I will be disppointed if it turns out you're the person who keeps commenting on my youtube videos to say they're in love with me

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I'm not so sure
(Anonymous)
2008-11-13 09:09 am UTC (link)
I like to think that I am not retarded or going to be from reading xkcd. I guess its all a matter of opinion but the reality with people who hate penny arcade or ctrl-alt-del or Yahtzee is that it won't actually change anything. Its an unfortunate situation if you wish it to be otherwise but saying things like this only allow you to express your opinion (but I think thats enough)

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